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microsoft.public.vb.general.discussion

Windows 8 on ARM won't run x86 apps

Abhishek

9/17/2011 2:29:00 PM

http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...

Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think they may
release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.


10 Answers

Tom Shelton

9/17/2011 3:37:00 PM

0

Abhishek expressed precisely :
> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>
> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think they may
> release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.

They don't need to release an add on to vs - they just need to have an
arm jit and framework.

--
Tom Shelton

mikeb

9/17/2011 9:44:00 PM

0


"Tom Shelton" <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> wrote in message
news:j52et7$kfl$1@dont-email.me...
> Abhishek expressed precisely :
>> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>>
>> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think they
>> may release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.
>
> They don't need to release an add on to vs - they just need to have an arm
> jit and framework.

That's what I was reading into the article about the push for WinC++,
because the frameword approach is too ponderous for small devices..

> --
> Tom Shelton
>
>


MikeD

9/17/2011 10:33:00 PM

0



"mbyerley" <mbyerley@byerley.net> wrote in message
news:dOKdnXf32qA0iejTnZ2dnUVZ_qydnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> "Tom Shelton" <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> wrote in message
> news:j52et7$kfl$1@dont-email.me...
>> Abhishek expressed precisely :
>>> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>>>
>>> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think they
>>> may release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.
>>
>> They don't need to release an add on to vs - they just need to have an
>> arm jit and framework.
>
> That's what I was reading into the article about the push for WinC++,
> because the frameword approach is too ponderous for small devices..
>


What the hell does any of this have to do with VB?

Granted, these newsgroups aren't nearly as active as they used to be so it's
one thing to go a little off-topic just so that there are SOME discussions
going on, but this is pushing it in my opinion. I still want to come here
and read about VB issues. If I wanted to read about Windows 8 and/or ARM,
I'd go to the proper places to discuss those things. Maybe others here are
interested in those things, but that still doesn't mean they should be
discussed here.

--
Mike

mikeb

9/18/2011 2:24:00 AM

0


"MikeD" <nobody@nowhere.edu> wrote in message
news:j5377j$frk$1@dont-email.me...
>
>
> "mbyerley" <mbyerley@byerley.net> wrote in message
> news:dOKdnXf32qA0iejTnZ2dnUVZ_qydnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>
>> "Tom Shelton" <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:j52et7$kfl$1@dont-email.me...
>>> Abhishek expressed precisely :
>>>> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>>>>
>>>> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think
>>>> they may release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.
>>>
>>> They don't need to release an add on to vs - they just need to have an
>>> arm jit and framework.
>>
>> That's what I was reading into the article about the push for WinC++,
>> because the frameword approach is too ponderous for small devices..
>>
>
>
> What the hell does any of this have to do with VB?

Nothing.. You're right.

It's off topic and I have just contributed a pittance to the mountain of the
same that this group has digressed to in recent times.
So I will just hang about and say naught.


>
> Granted, these newsgroups aren't nearly as active as they used to be so
> it's one thing to go a little off-topic just so that there are SOME
> discussions going on, but this is pushing it in my opinion. I still want
> to come here and read about VB issues. If I wanted to read about Windows 8
> and/or ARM, I'd go to the proper places to discuss those things. Maybe
> others here are interested in those things, but that still doesn't mean
> they should be discussed here.
>
> --
> Mike
>
>


Abhishek

9/18/2011 3:53:00 AM

0


"MikeD" <nobody@nowhere.edu> wrote in message
news:j5377j$frk$1@dont-email.me...
|
| What the hell does any of this have to do with VB?
|

VB6 apps are x86 apps.


Dee Earley

9/19/2011 9:03:00 AM

0

On 18/09/2011 04:53, Abhishek wrote:
> "MikeD"<nobody@nowhere.edu> wrote in message
> news:j5377j$frk$1@dont-email.me...
> |
> | What the hell does any of this have to do with VB?
>
> VB6 apps are x86 apps.

So are (current) Win32 C++ apps.
This is not VB6 specific, it just means they won't be available, just
like the mountain of MS applications they say they won't port to ARM.

--
Dee Earley (dee.earley@icode.co.uk)
i-Catcher Development Team
http://www.icode.co.uk...

iCode Systems

(Replies direct to my email address will be ignored.
Please reply to the group.)

Jeff Johnson [MVP: VB]

9/19/2011 2:20:00 PM

0

"Abhishek" <abhishek007p@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:j52ari$er3$1@speranza.aioe.org...

> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>
> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think they
> may
> release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.

Why is this news? Who in the world ever thought a phone would run a PC app?
I can understand if there is some sort of intermediate language and that
Windows 8-SPECIFIC apps, i.e., apps written for the ridiculous phone façade,
would run on both the PC and the phone, but x86 apps? Never.


Tom Shelton

9/19/2011 5:10:00 PM

0

Jeff Johnson expressed precisely :
> "Abhishek" <abhishek007p@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:j52ari$er3$1@speranza.aioe.org...
>
>> http://www.neowin.net/news/windows-8-microsoft-reaffirms-arm-wont-ru...
>>
>> Windows on ARM is to compete with iPad and Android Tablets. I think
>> they may
>> release a add-on for VS to compile .NET apps.
>
> Why is this news?

Because apparently, no one understood when it was clearly stated
several times that x86 compiled software wouldn't run on ARM... Well,
duh!

> Who in the world ever thought a phone would run a
> PC app?

When has MS showed Windows 8 running on a phone? Oh, right they
havent'. Just because there is a lot of speculation (and that's all it
is at this point) that winphone 8 will have the same kernel and maybe
even app model, that doesn't mean it will support the desktop mode that
is clearly supported in win8 on ARM.

Look at the demo's of flash running on qualcom and office running on
nvidia's Kal-El...

office on arm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m...

Flash on snapdragon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8...


These demo's would seem to indicate that an arm version of the win32
api is there (just as it was on risc architectures) - and that x86 apps
just need to be recompiled for arm...

> I can understand if there is some sort of intermediate
> language and that Windows 8-SPECIFIC apps, i.e., apps written for the
> ridiculous phone façade, would run on both the PC and the phone, but
> x86 apps? Never.

x86 binaries will not run - that should be obvious to anyone that has
even a basic understanding of computer architecture - but most likely
apps will be able to be cross compiled. At least C++ apps. I also
speculate, that current .net apps will work as well - but, I haven't
seen anyone say for sure yet that their will be a full .net framework
on arm - but, it's likely given that in the x86 version, even the metro
apps use a full version of .NET - they just basically disallow certain
classes and namespaces from being used inside of metro.

Right now, we do know that metro apps created using .net will run on
both without a recompile. Those created using C++ will have to be
cross compiled for arm (basically have two binaries).

What should be obvious, is there is no way that VB.CLASSIC will be able
to run in the ARM world. Hence my suggestion that Abishek migrate to
C++ - since, it will be able to run on both x86 and ARM, and if
archtected right (primarily seperating gui from logic) - even be able
to be ported to other OS's with realitve ease. In fact, I am seriously
considering this option for my own stuff. I've always had a soft spot
for C++ anyway :)


--
Tom Shelton

Tony Toews

9/19/2011 7:07:00 PM

0

On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 11:09:52 -0600, Tom Shelton
<tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> wrote:

>office on arm
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m...

Thanks for the video showing Word running on the ARM.

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/ac...
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blo...
For a convenient utility to keep your users FEs and other files
updated see http://www.autofeup...

Mayayana

9/20/2011 1:22:00 PM

0


| Why is this news? Who in the world ever thought a phone would run a PC
app?

Then again, who ever thought that people would
be web browsing on a 2" screen while sitting across
the room from the dark 50" screen of their flatscreen TV?

There have been a couple of clarifying articles online:

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/microsoft-desktop-apps-will-run-on-windows-8-on...

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/19/programming_for_...

The gist seems to be that software can be compiled for
x86 or ARM, which is not the same as Desktop and
Metro. Both Desktop and Metro can be on either PC
or Etch-A-Sketch, allegedly, but MS will get a 30% cut
of sales, plus veto control, on Metro software. (And how
useful would Desktop software be on a tablet, after all?)

It seems that the main news is what hasn't changed:
Microsoft is still moving -- at a snail's pace and yet as fast
as they can get away with -- toward a more closed
system of interactive TV where computer functionality is
mainly aimed at titillating "consumers" for cash, and MS
controls the cash register.
I think the saddest thing about MS is that they've simply
never had any vision about what they're doing, aside from
making money. They're in a position to do such interesting
things, yet they sink to the pursuit of merely "winning".

In guidelines published here:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/apps/hh464912%28v=vs....

Metro is described with such bizarre words as "aliveness",
while one topic heading is titled:
"Engaging the user and keeping them engaged"
... So VB probably can't do Metro, but then...
who wants to do Metro? It's essentially a forced
redefinition of computers as entertainment devices,
where software developers are MS subcontractors.
If I wanted to do that then why not just go work
under Lord Jobs? At least AppleSeeds pay retail for
their pacifiers.