Asp Forum - Re: Intensive computing: Ruby? Ruby/C? Pure C++?

Ryan Davis

1/17/2007 5:48:00 PM

On Jan 17, 2007, at 2:00 AM, Shot (Piotr Szotkowski) wrote:

> Background: I'm a PhD student at Warsaw University of Technology and
> I need to write a project that's going to be fairly intensive in both
> computing and memory usage (symbolic functional decomposition of FSMs
> for FPGA implementation); [...]

Some work has been done in this area to some extent. Check out RHDL
from Phil Tomson. I believe it is pure ruby only.

> The question: in my case, which approach seems to make most sense?
>
> 1. Pure Ruby. This will most probably not be an option; my gut
> feeling is that pure Ruby will end up being *way* too slow and
> memory-inefficient. Still, definitely the fun approach, and actually
> maybe the fastest prototyping.

Gut feelings are often wrong. Especially in this arena. You can also
take advantage of very easy parallelism available through systems
like rinda.

> 2. Ruby with C extensions. Code in Ruby first, then optimise the slow
> parts one after another. This is tempting (mmm, Ruby...), but I'm
> not sure how viable; if I'm going to have to rewrite 90% in C anyway,
> I might as well start with C++ (again, only a gut feeling).

This is the approach I choose most of the time. Just Do It. If it is
slow, make the slow bits faster. It is exactly why RubyInline exists
in the first place. Just make sure you do good profiling (use shugo's
rubyprof or my zenprofiler--soon to be repackaged separately. Do NOT
use the native one as anything more than a cursory glance, especially
if your code does a ton of small method calls).

> 3. Pure C++. I have to learn C/C++ anyway almost certainly (for point
> 2 above), so maybe trying to have fun and going with Ruby is not the
> best way this time, and I should simply install CDT, stock on C++
> tutorials and be a brave, if sad, person?

Blech. Ptooey! I don't even consider this an option anymore.

9 Answers

Shot (Piotr Szotkowski)

1/19/2007 6:18:00 PM

Thanks a lot for your reply, Ryan!

// Also, as to not pollute the list with separate mails: thanks to
// everybody else who commented in this thread! I learned more in the
// past two days than I hoped to learn 'till the end of January!
// Unfortunately, it might mean I'll come back with more questions... ;)

Ryan Davis:

> On Jan 17, 2007, at 2:00 AM, Shot (Piotr Szotkowski) wrote:

>> symbolic functional decomposition of FSMs for FPGA implementation

> Some work has been done in this area to some extent. Check
> out RHDL from Phil Tomson. I believe it is pure ruby only.

Thanks, again! I'm already eager to drill into his Ruby-interpretation
of an FSM, and it's not even weekend here yet... :)

>> my gut feeling is that pure Ruby will end up
>> being *way* too slow and memory-inefficient.

> Gut feelings are often wrong. Especially in this arena.

I hope this one is. Still, my supervisor's C++ classes are quite
optimised, and it's not rare for a decomposition to run for two days
straight; hopefully the benchmarks needed to prove the scientific value
of my thesis are of the less-time-consuming kind.

> You can also take advantage of very easy
> parallelism available through systems like rinda.

Thanks for pointing out Rinda, I'll definitely take a closer look.
Unfortunately, decomposition is a highly iterative process, so I doubt
it's at all paralellable (some parts of a single iteration might be,
though).

>> 2. Ruby with C extensions.

> This is the approach I choose most of the time. Just Do It.

I talked with my supervisor, and he said that if going with Ruby means
I'll show up with anything that actually works even just a bit sooner,
then he's all for it. :)

Thanks a lot for pointers to rubyprof and zenprofiler!

-- Shot, currently in the 'Ruby or Lua? Ruby or Lua?' mode...
--
I'm not much of a kernel hacker, but a quick (and not very efficient,
granted) fix could be to make the offset an extern variable, yes?
That would force the compiler to fall back on the basic "your gun,
your foot, your choice" memory model. -- jtv, LKML

Ara.T.Howard

1/19/2007 6:36:00 PM

Peter Booth

4/23/2007 8:00:00 PM

Shot,

So far the discussion has been very rational and focused on technical
merits. It's also worth considering enlightened self-interest:

If you are planning on working in quantitative finance then you
should use C++ because that is the language of choice for
quantitative finance. If you expect to work in non-telecoms IT then
you should use Java because that will be more valuable.

If neither are issue you should certainly use Ruby because it will be
more productive - the time you spend tuning Ruby is probably less
than the time you would spend waiting around for C++ builds to finish
and chasing down pointer bugs and mysterious crashes. And if the time
isn't less it will at the very least be more fun!

-Peter

On Jan 19, 2007, at 1:17 PM, Shot (Piotr Szotkowski) wrote:

> Thanks a lot for your reply, Ryan!
>
> // Also, as to not pollute the list with separate mails: thanks to
> // everybody else who commented in this thread! I learned more in the
> // past two days than I hoped to learn 'till the end of January!
> // Unfortunately, it might mean I'll come back with more
> questions... ;)
>
> Ryan Davis:
>
>> On Jan 17, 2007, at 2:00 AM, Shot (Piotr Szotkowski) wrote:
>
>>> symbolic functional decomposition of FSMs for FPGA implementation
>
>> Some work has been done in this area to some extent. Check
>> out RHDL from Phil Tomson. I believe it is pure ruby only.
>
> Thanks, again! I'm already eager to drill into his Ruby-interpretation
> of an FSM, and it's not even weekend here yet... :)
>
>>> my gut feeling is that pure Ruby will end up
>>> being *way* too slow and memory-inefficient.
>
>> Gut feelings are often wrong. Especially in this arena.
>
> I hope this one is. Still, my supervisor's C++ classes are quite
> optimised, and it's not rare for a decomposition to run for two days
> straight; hopefully the benchmarks needed to prove the scientific
> value
> of my thesis are of the less-time-consuming kind.
>
>> You can also take advantage of very easy
>> parallelism available through systems like rinda.
>
> Thanks for pointing out Rinda, I'll definitely take a closer look.
> Unfortunately, decomposition is a highly iterative process, so I doubt
> it's at all paralellable (some parts of a single iteration might be,
> though).
>
>>> 2. Ruby with C extensions.
>
>> This is the approach I choose most of the time. Just Do It.
>
> I talked with my supervisor, and he said that if going with Ruby means
> I'll show up with anything that actually works even just a bit sooner,
> then he's all for it. :)
>
> Thanks a lot for pointers to rubyprof and zenprofiler!
>
> -- Shot, currently in the 'Ruby or Lua? Ruby or Lua?' mode...
> --
> I'm not much of a kernel hacker, but a quick (and not very efficient,
> granted) fix could be to make the offset an extern variable, yes?
> That would force the compiler to fall back on the basic "your gun,
> your foot, your choice" memory model. -- jtv, LKML
>

Peter Booth
peter_booth@mac.com
917 445 5663

fanabba

1/8/2012 5:01:00 PM

On Jan 8, 3:49 am, use...@mantra.com and/or www.mantra.com/jai (Dr.
Jai Maharaj) wrote:
> Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
>
> PTI
> The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>
> Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez Musharraf has
> denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden
> living in his country during his tenure.
>
> In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz, Musharraf
> insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per cent sure about
> himself that he did not know he (Osama bin Laden) was there.
>
> "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
> bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
> watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
> oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
> was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
>
> "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
> strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
> either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
> bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
> became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
>
> "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
> those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
> three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
> was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
> sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
> intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
>
> "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
>
> The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees as a
> tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy to spot,
> thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely incompetent
> or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
>
> "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
> the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
> But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
> army base in North Carolina].
>
> "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
> going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
> and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
>
> "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
> They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
> Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
> wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
> normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
> argued in defence.
>
> http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-de...
>
> More at:http://www.dailyp...
>
> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> Om Shanti
>
> -----
>
> About the terrorist Goon Squad:
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
> to do away with opposition.
>
> "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
> tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
> where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
> about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
> miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
> Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
> to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
> heart disease.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
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Musharraf is lying.
He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
Deception) agains non-Muslims.

usenet

1/8/2012 6:46:00 PM

In article <17a47b91-eef7-4e9f-ac9b-5a79ebea0644@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
fanabba <fanabba@aol.com> posted:
>
> Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>
> > Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
> >
> > PTI
> > The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
> > Sunday, January 8, 2012
> >
> > Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez Musharraf has
> > denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden
> > living in his country during his tenure.
> >
> > In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz, Musharraf
> > insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per cent sure about
> > himself that he did not know he (Osama bin Laden) was there.
> >
> > "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
> > bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
> > watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
> > oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
> > was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
> >
> > "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
> > strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
> > either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
> > bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
> > became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
> >
> > "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
> > those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
> > three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
> > was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
> > sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
> > intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
> >
> > "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
> >
> > The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees as a
> > tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy to spot,
> > thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely incompetent
> > or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
> >
> > "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
> > the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
> > But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
> > army base in North Carolina].
> >
> > "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
> > going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
> > and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
> >
> > "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
> > They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
> > Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
> > wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
> > normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
> > argued in defence.
> >
> > http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-de...
> >
> > More at:http://www.dailyp...
> >
> > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > Om Shanti
> >
> > -----
> >
> > About the terrorist Goon Squad:
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
> > to do away with opposition.
> >
> > "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
> > tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
> > where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
> > about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
> > miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
> > Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
> > to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
> > heart disease.
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Musharraf is lying.
> He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
> Deception) agains non-Muslims.

You are absolutely correct! One can be certain that he not only knew
where Muslim terrorist Osama bin Laden was hidden but also managed
his hiding place.

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

usenet

1/8/2012 7:37:00 PM

Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>
> In article
> <17a47b91-eef7-4e9f-ac9b-5a79ebea0644@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
> fanabba <fanabba@aol.com> posted:
> >
> > Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
> >
> > > Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
> > >
> > > PTI
> > > The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
> > > Sunday, January 8, 2012
> > >
> > > Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez Musharraf has
> > > denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden
> > > living in his country during his tenure.
> > >
> > > In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz, Musharraf
> > > insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per cent sure about
> > > himself that he did not know he (Osama bin Laden) was there.
> > >
> > > "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
> > > bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
> > > watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
> > > oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
> > > was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
> > >
> > > "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
> > > strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
> > > either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
> > > bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
> > > became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
> > >
> > > "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
> > > those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
> > > three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
> > > was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
> > > sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
> > > intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
> > >
> > > "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
> > >
> > > The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees as a
> > > tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy to spot,
> > > thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely incompetent
> > > or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
> > >
> > > "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
> > > the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
> > > But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
> > > army base in North Carolina].
> > >
> > > "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
> > > going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
> > > and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
> > >
> > > "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
> > > They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
> > > Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
> > > wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
> > > normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
> > > argued in defence.
> > >
> > > http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-de...
> > >
> > > More at:http://www.dailyp...
> > >
> > > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > > Om Shanti
> > >
> > > -----
> > >
> > > About the terrorist Goon Squad:
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
> > > to do away with opposition.
> > >
> > > "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
> > > tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
> > > where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
> > > about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
> > > miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
> > > Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
> > > to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
> > > heart disease.
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > Musharraf is lying.
> > He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
> > Deception) agains non-Muslims.
>
> You are absolutely correct! One can be certain that he not only knew
> where Muslim terrorist Osama bin Laden was hidden but also managed
> his hiding place.
>
> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> Om Shanti

Forwarded post from S. K. 2

Sunday, January 8, 2012

He has always lied. If you red his book you will find that he was
fighting on 3 fronts during 1971 war. His father was an officer and
yet he went by rail whereas Govt of Pakistan lifted her civil
servants by air. He claims he sat of Rs. 70,000 in a trunk as it was
given to his father for the Govt of Pakistan. His book is full of
fabrication and NOW THIS?"

Was his number 2 man Gen. Kiyani not running ISI who protected OBL or
did he kept him out of loop for all these years. WHAT A LIAR and born
enemy of INDIA.

So now a Muslim is going to recognise Israel to break up India
friendship. Will he stop supporting Hamas and other palstinian
parties?

End of forwarded post from S. K. 2

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

usenet

1/8/2012 7:42:00 PM

Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>
> > In article
> > <17a47b91-eef7-4e9f-ac9b-5a79ebea0644@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
> > fanabba <fanabba@aol.com> posted:
> > >
> > > Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
> > >
> > > > Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
> > > >
> > > > PTI
> > > > The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
> > > > Sunday, January 8, 2012
> > > >
> > > > Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez Musharraf has
> > > > denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden
> > > > living in his country during his tenure.
> > > >
> > > > In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz, Musharraf
> > > > insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per cent sure about
> > > > himself that he did not know he (Osama bin Laden) was there.
> > > >
> > > > "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
> > > > bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
> > > > watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
> > > > oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
> > > > was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
> > > >
> > > > "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
> > > > strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
> > > > either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
> > > > bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
> > > > became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
> > > >
> > > > "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
> > > > those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
> > > > three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
> > > > was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
> > > > sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
> > > > intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
> > > >
> > > > "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
> > > >
> > > > The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees as a
> > > > tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy to spot,
> > > > thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely incompetent
> > > > or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
> > > >
> > > > "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
> > > > the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
> > > > But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
> > > > army base in North Carolina].
> > > >
> > > > "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
> > > > going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
> > > > and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
> > > >
> > > > "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
> > > > They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
> > > > Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
> > > > wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
> > > > normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
> > > > argued in defence.
> > > >
> > > > http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-de...
> > > >
> > > > More at:http://www.dailyp...
> > > >
> > > > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > > > Om Shanti
> > > >
> > > > -----
> > > >
> > > > About the terrorist Goon Squad:
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
> > > > to do away with opposition.
> > > >
> > > > "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
> > > > tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
> > > > where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
> > > > about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
> > > > miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
> > > > Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
> > > > to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
> > > > heart disease.
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > > Musharraf is lying.
> > > He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
> > > Deception) agains non-Muslims.
> >
> > You are absolutely correct! One can be certain that he not only knew
> > where Muslim terrorist Osama bin Laden was hidden but also managed
> > his hiding place.
> >
> > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > Om Shanti
>
> Forwarded post from S. K. 2
>
> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>
> He has always lied. If you red his book you will find that he was
> fighting on 3 fronts during 1971 war. His father was an officer and
> yet he went by rail whereas Govt of Pakistan lifted her civil
> servants by air. He claims he sat of Rs. 70,000 in a trunk as it was
> given to his father for the Govt of Pakistan. His book is full of
> fabrication and NOW THIS?"
>
> Was his number 2 man Gen. Kiyani not running ISI who protected OBL or
> did he kept him out of loop for all these years. WHAT A LIAR and born
> enemy of INDIA.
>
> So now a Muslim is going to recognise Israel to break up India
> friendship. Will he stop supporting Hamas and other palstinian
> parties?
>
> End of forwarded post from S. K. 2
>
> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> Om Shanti

Forwarded post from M.

Sunday, January 8, 2012

Chacha is fedup with Zardari/Gilani's China/Iran friendlinss.
Military ties are in shambles.

So Musharraf is the last best. He has tied up with MI5 agent Imran
Khan and now trying to endear himself to Chacha's henchmen, on his
way back to Pakistan.

Musharraf is bad news for India. He is the most anti-Indian of Pak
rulers, but not a Taliban himself. This makes him doubly dangerous.

End of forwarded post from M.

[Note from Jai Maharaj: Chacha = uncle = Uncle Sam in this context.]

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

usenet

1/8/2012 7:46:00 PM

Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>
> > > In article
> > > <17a47b91-eef7-4e9f-ac9b-5a79ebea0644@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
> > > fanabba <fanabba@aol.com> posted:
> > > >
> > > > Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
> > > >
> > > > > Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
> > > > >
> > > > > PTI
> > > > > The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
> > > > > Sunday, January 8, 2012
> > > > >
> > > > > Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez Musharraf has
> > > > > denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden
> > > > > living in his country during his tenure.
> > > > >
> > > > > In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz, Musharraf
> > > > > insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per cent sure about
> > > > > himself that he did not know he (Osama bin Laden) was there.
> > > > >
> > > > > "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
> > > > > bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
> > > > > watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
> > > > > oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
> > > > > was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
> > > > >
> > > > > "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
> > > > > strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
> > > > > either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
> > > > > bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
> > > > > became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
> > > > >
> > > > > "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
> > > > > those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
> > > > > three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
> > > > > was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
> > > > > sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
> > > > > intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
> > > > >
> > > > > "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
> > > > >
> > > > > The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees as a
> > > > > tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy to spot,
> > > > > thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely incompetent
> > > > > or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
> > > > >
> > > > > "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
> > > > > the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
> > > > > But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
> > > > > army base in North Carolina].
> > > > >
> > > > > "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
> > > > > going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
> > > > > and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
> > > > >
> > > > > "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
> > > > > They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
> > > > > Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
> > > > > wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
> > > > > normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
> > > > > argued in defence.
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-denies-he-knew-bin-laden-was-living-in-pakistan.html
> > > > >
> > > > > More at:http://www.dailyp...
> > > > >
> > > > > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > > > > Om Shanti
> > > > >
> > > > > -----
> > > > >
> > > > > About the terrorist Goon Squad:
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
> > > > > to do away with opposition.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
> > > > > tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
> > > > > where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
> > > > > about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
> > > > > miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
> > > > > Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
> > > > > to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
> > > > > heart disease.
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Musharraf is lying.
> > > > He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
> > > > Deception) agains non-Muslims.
> > >
> > > You are absolutely correct! One can be certain that he not only knew
> > > where Muslim terrorist Osama bin Laden was hidden but also managed
> > > his hiding place.
> > >
> > > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > > Om Shanti
> >
> > Forwarded post from S. K. 2
> >
> > Sunday, January 8, 2012
> >
> > He has always lied. If you red his book you will find that he was
> > fighting on 3 fronts during 1971 war. His father was an officer and
> > yet he went by rail whereas Govt of Pakistan lifted her civil
> > servants by air. He claims he sat of Rs. 70,000 in a trunk as it was
> > given to his father for the Govt of Pakistan. His book is full of
> > fabrication and NOW THIS?"
> >
> > Was his number 2 man Gen. Kiyani not running ISI who protected OBL or
> > did he kept him out of loop for all these years. WHAT A LIAR and born
> > enemy of INDIA.
> >
> > So now a Muslim is going to recognise Israel to break up India
> > friendship. Will he stop supporting Hamas and other palstinian
> > parties?
> >
> > End of forwarded post from S. K. 2
> >
> > Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> > Om Shanti
>
> Forwarded post from M.
>
> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>
> Chacha is fedup with Zardari/Gilani's China/Iran friendlinss.
> Military ties are in shambles.
>
> So Musharraf is the last best. He has tied up with MI5 agent Imran
> Khan and now trying to endear himself to Chacha's henchmen, on his
> way back to Pakistan.
>
> Musharraf is bad news for India. He is the most anti-Indian of Pak
> rulers, but not a Taliban himself. This makes him doubly dangerous.
>
> End of forwarded post from M.
>
> [Note from Jai Maharaj: Chacha = uncle = Uncle Sam in this context.]
>
> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> Om Shanti

Forwarded post from M. J.

Sunday, January 8, 2012

Liar Musa will not hesitate one second on nuking India if Pakis are
caught once again aiding worldwide terror ring. Kayani and Musa are
graduates of elite US Army's Foreign officers training school and
they know most US army brass by first names. Musa is the original
back stabbing guy who coordinated Kargil attacks behind naive
Hajpayee and Advani. He even fooled General Colin Powell by hiding
OBL in Paki army's living quarters.

Musa with General Kayani to run army and Pasha to run ISI - it will
be 100% bad news for India. Not to forget that Musa will wink to
Chinese behind Americans. If you have a choice between Musa and a
snake, choose snake. It is very sad that the US and Brits are doing
everything to win Paki hearts at India's loss. This is a typical
western mind set: kill two birds (China and India) with one stone
(Pakis).

They are forgetting that Pakis will only target India and the same
stone will bounce back to the US with vengeance. Musa is an
architect of 9/11.

End of forwarded post from M. J.

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

usenet

1/9/2012 8:17:00 AM

Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>
>>>> In article
>>>> <17a47b91-eef7-4e9f-ac9b-5a79ebea0644@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
>>>> fanabba <fanabba@aol.com> posted:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Musharraf denies he knew bin Laden was living in Pakistan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PTI
>>>>>> The Pioneerhttp://www.dailyp...
>>>>>> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jerusalem - Pakistan's former President General Pervez
>>>>>> Musharraf has denied having knowledge about the al-Qaida chief
>>>>>> Osama bin Laden living in his country during his tenure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In his first ever interview to an Israeli daily, Ha'aretz,
>>>>>> Musharraf insisted on his innocence and said he was 100 per
>>>>>> cent sure about himself that he did not know he (Osama bin
>>>>>> Laden) was there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I am very sure about my answer. Especially so because when they say
>>>>>> bin Laden was there for five years, that means two years under my
>>>>>> watch. Well, one cannot be sure of others, but one can be sure of
>>>>>> oneself. And I am 100 percent sure of myself that I did not know he
>>>>>> was there," Musharraf said when asked about Bin laden's presence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I say the question is, was there complicity or negligence? And I
>>>>>> strongly believe it was negligence. Of course, that's not great
>>>>>> either, it's terrible negligence and shameful. But, while both are
>>>>>> bad -- complicity would be worse," said the former President, who
>>>>>> became a key ally of western in fight against terror post 9/11.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I don't have any doubt of that. I know there was no complicity for
>>>>>> those two years. And perhaps there was complicity during the latter
>>>>>> three years, but I don't believe that either. It's not possible. It
>>>>>> was negligence," Musharraf, explaining the negligence, said that
>>>>>> sinceOsama was not using telephone communications, it is human
>>>>>> intelligence that comes to ISI, but no one knew him around that area.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "None of the neighbours knew him," he stressed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The former Pakistani leader also expresses anger at what he sees
>>>>>> as a tendency in the West to portray bin Laden's hideout as easy
>>>>>> to spot, thus hinting that the Pakistanis were either completely
>>>>>> incompetent or, more likely, cooperating with the terrorist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "They say in the West that he was living in a garrison town, and that
>>>>>> the house was huge, with exceptionally high walls which stood out.
>>>>>> But I disagree with all of this. This was no Fort Bragg [a massive US
>>>>>> army base in North Carolina].
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "He was staying in an open, tourist resort kind of place. Anyone
>>>>>> going to the north could stop there. There are hotels, and schools
>>>>>> and stores -- so the story is exaggerated," Musharraf pointed out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "And the house? It was bigger than average, but not much. And walls?
>>>>>> They don't necessarily have walls in the US around houses, but in
>>>>>> Pakistan the first thing a man does when he gets a house is build a
>>>>>> wall around it. That may be abnormal in the West, but it's perfectly
>>>>>> normal in Pakistan and does not arouse any suspicion at all," he
>>>>>> argued in defence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.dailyp.../pioneer-news/top-story/33554-musharraf-denies-he-knew-bin-laden-was-living-in-pakistan.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> More at:http://www.dailyp...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
>>>>>> Om Shanti
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----
>>>>>>
>>>>>> About the terrorist Goon Squad:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
>>>>>> to do away with opposition.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluMallu...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
>>>>>> where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
>>>>>> about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
>>>>>> miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
>>>>>> Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah", and issues *death threats*
>>>>>> to people), is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
>>>>>> heart disease.
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Musharraf is lying.
>>>>> He is a devout Muslim and is engaging in Taqiyya (Islamic Holy
>>>>> Deception) agains non-Muslims.
>>>>
>>>> You are absolutely correct! One can be certain that he not only knew
>>>> where Muslim terrorist Osama bin Laden was hidden but also managed
>>>> his hiding place.
>>>>
>>>> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
>>>> Om Shanti
>>>
>>> Forwarded post from S. K. 2
>>>
>>> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>>>
>>> He has always lied. If you red his book you will find that he was
>>> fighting on 3 fronts during 1971 war. His father was an officer and
>>> yet he went by rail whereas Govt of Pakistan lifted her civil
>>> servants by air. He claims he sat of Rs. 70,000 in a trunk as it was
>>> given to his father for the Govt of Pakistan. His book is full of
>>> fabrication and NOW THIS?"
>>>
>>> Was his number 2 man Gen. Kiyani not running ISI who protected OBL or
>>> did he kept him out of loop for all these years. WHAT A LIAR and born
>>> enemy of INDIA.
>>>
>>> So now a Muslim is going to recognise Israel to break up India
>>> friendship. Will he stop supporting Hamas and other palstinian
>>> parties?
>>>
>>> End of forwarded post from S. K. 2
>>>
>>> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
>>> Om Shanti
>>
>> Forwarded post from M.
>>
>> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>>
>> Chacha is fedup with Zardari/Gilani's China/Iran friendlinss.
>> Military ties are in shambles.
>>
>> So Musharraf is the last best. He has tied up with MI5 agent Imran
>> Khan and now trying to endear himself to Chacha's henchmen, on his
>> way back to Pakistan.
>>
>> Musharraf is bad news for India. He is the most anti-Indian of Pak
>> rulers, but not a Taliban himself. This makes him doubly dangerous.
>>
>> End of forwarded post from M.
>>
>> [Note from Jai Maharaj: Chacha = uncle = Uncle Sam in this context.]
>>
>> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
>> Om Shanti
>
> Forwarded post from M. J.
>
> Sunday, January 8, 2012
>
> Liar Musa will not hesitate one second on nuking India if Pakis are
> caught once again aiding worldwide terror ring. Kayani and Musa are
> graduates of elite US Army's Foreign officers training school and
> they know most US army brass by first names. Musa is the original
> back stabbing guy who coordinated Kargil attacks behind naive
> Hajpayee and Advani. He even fooled General Colin Powell by hiding
> OBL in Paki army's living quarters.
>
> Musa with General Kayani to run army and Pasha to run ISI - it will
> be 100% bad news for India. Not to forget that Musa will wink to
> Chinese behind Americans. If you have a choice between Musa and a
> snake, choose snake. It is very sad that the US and Brits are doing
> everything to win Paki hearts at India's loss. This is a typical
> western mind set: kill two birds (China and India) with one stone
> (Pakis).
>
> They are forgetting that Pakis will only target India and the same
> stone will bounce back to the US with vengeance. Musa is an
> architect of 9/11.
>
> End of forwarded post from M. J.
>
> Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
> Om Shanti

Forwarded post from M.

Sunday, January 8, 2012

Kayani is visiting China now, having publicised meetings with China's
civilian and military leaders. Kashmir wasn't mentioned. The focus
seems to be Afghanistan but the real focus is to project Kayani as
the person in charge. Chacha won't be pleased, the visit came a day
after the F16 deal was announced. Pakistan is becoming an expert in
having the cake and eating it too :)

Pasha is reviving ISI couduits in Bangladesh & Nepal, after Kayani et
al foced the stoppage of CIA drones. During the drone operations the
ISI needed aditional personnel to evacuate strategic assets durig the
strikes, now they are being moved out. More independence to the
Jihadi outfits, better deniability and ability to focus on India.
Indian approach to counter ISI has been the same. Do nothing, and
wait for the next strike. Gandhi has made the Hindu the willing
bakra, ever willing to sacrifice oneself in the alter of Jihad.

Why else would they elect those who can't defend the people.

End of forwarded post from M.

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

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