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comp.lang.ruby

[BLOG] A different perspective on Ruby.

ES

5/26/2005 3:47:00 AM


This has perhaps been aired here already, if so, apologies.

Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
these takes as well since the actually bring up some
(fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.

http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...

E


--
template<typename duck>
void quack(duck& d) { d.quack(); }
46 Answers

james_b

5/26/2005 4:19:00 AM

0

ES wrote:
> This has perhaps been aired here already, if so, apologies.
>
> Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
> these takes as well since the actually bring up some
> (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.
>
> http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...

First, an OT question: Is there a Firefox extension that lets me
*quickly* disable/enable page colors? I know I can do this via the Web
dev tool bar stuff, but it's too many clicks, and sites with white text
on a dark background (hip as that may be) are so painful to look at I
get retina burn before I can finish all that clicking.

About the log entry. I have a rule of thumb. If someone is using the
words "shit" or "fuck" three or four times on page, they quickly lose
all credibility. (Certain words should be treated like global
variables: saved for special cases and for specific effect.)

I like reading critiques (or criticism, even) of Ruby, but most of what
was mentioned there were straw man arguments. Certainly POLS is a known
subjective aspect and an easy target. I expect everyone reading
ruby-talk could assemble a list of cases where Ruby violates their own
sense of POLS.


James Britt

--

http://www.ru... - The Ruby Documentation Site
http://www.r... - News, Articles, and Listings for Ruby & XML
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Martin DeMello

5/26/2005 5:36:00 AM

0

James Britt <james_b@neurogami.com> wrote:
>
> First, an OT question: Is there a Firefox extension that lets me
> *quickly* disable/enable page colors? I know I can do this via the Web
> dev tool bar stuff, but it's too many clicks, and sites with white text
> on a dark background (hip as that may be) are so painful to look at I
> get retina burn before I can finish all that clicking.

I use a bookmarklet in my bookmarks toolbar for this.

http://www.squarefree.com/bookmarklet...

martin

Luc Heinrich

5/26/2005 7:52:00 AM

0

On 26 mai 05, at 05:46, ES wrote:

> Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
> these takes as well since the actually bring up some
> (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.

Some valid points ? I think this guy does not know what he's talking
about, or simply did not read the documentation correctly, or is
simply blinded by something he should unlearn first, or simply likes
making straw man arguments for the sake of it, or simply likes to
rant (that I can understand, I like it too :) ).

And calling the language creator(s) "fucktard(s)" really doesn't help
making a point, really.

--
Luc Heinrich - lucsky@mac.com - http://www.hon...

Dennis Roberts

5/26/2005 8:16:00 AM

0

He is 18 and just out of high school and thinks he knows everything.
I think everyone goes through that phase.

On 5/26/05, Luc Heinrich <lucsky@mac.com> wrote:
> On 26 mai 05, at 05:46, ES wrote:
>
> > Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
> > these takes as well since the actually bring up some
> > (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.
>
> Some valid points ? I think this guy does not know what he's talking
> about, or simply did not read the documentation correctly, or is
> simply blinded by something he should unlearn first, or simply likes
> making straw man arguments for the sake of it, or simply likes to
> rant (that I can understand, I like it too :) ).
>
> And calling the language creator(s) "fucktard(s)" really doesn't help
> making a point, really.
>
> --
> Luc Heinrich - lucsky@mac.com - http://www.hon...
>
>
>

gabriele renzi

5/26/2005 9:32:00 AM

0

Martin DeMello ha scritto:

> I use a bookmarklet in my bookmarks toolbar for this.
>

for *just a second* I've been thinking you used a toolbar to collect
places where ruby-talk shows that POLS relates to Matz' least surprise.
How lovely.

Andrew Walrond

5/26/2005 9:36:00 AM

0

On Thursday 26 May 2005 04:46, ES wrote:
> This has perhaps been aired here already, if so, apologies.
>
> Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
> these takes as well since the actually bring up some
> (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.
>
> http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...
>

Despite the fucking swearing, he did come up with a list of almost everything
that has confused or annoyed me since I started using ruby.

What he neglected to mention is that Ruby is without doubt the closest attempt
yet at a perfect scripting language. Sure, it has some wrinkles, but I have
high hopes of those being sorted in the next iteration, whether by Matz or by
somebody else standing on his (and other giants) shoulders.

Despite the colourful language, an insightful critique and worth a quick
browse.

Andrew Walrond

PS The lack of documentation regarding method thrown exceptions is perhaps my
favourite criticism. Not at all core, but frustrating as hell when writing
OO /exception driven programs.

gabriele renzi

5/26/2005 9:37:00 AM

0

Luc Heinrich ha scritto:
> On 26 mai 05, at 05:46, ES wrote:
>
>> Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
>> these takes as well since the actually bring up some
>> (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.
>
>
> Some valid points ? I think this guy does not know what he's talking
> about, or simply did not read the documentation correctly, or is simply
> blinded by something he should unlearn first, or simply likes making
> straw man arguments for the sake of it, or simply likes to rant (that I
> can understand, I like it too :) ).
>

I think this is a bad written rant, but I agree that I'd like implicit
namespace creation a-la python and that it's refreshing to see some ruby
critiques.

Austin Ziegler

5/26/2005 11:12:00 AM

0

On 5/25/05, ES <ruby-ml@magical-cat.org> wrote:
> This has perhaps been aired here already, if so, apologies.
>
> Someone did not like Ruby; I find it refreshing to read
> these takes as well since the actually bring up some
> (fairly) valid points, this one moreso than usual.
>
> http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...

I haven't seen it, and I see very little valid on that page.

-austin
--
Austin Ziegler * halostatue@gmail.com
* Alternate: austin@halostatue.ca

Gavin Sinclair

5/26/2005 12:33:00 PM

0

ES wrote:

> http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...

"It's 5.abs for absolute value, but Math.sqrt(5) for square root."

Good point. That bugs me too. abs is a *function*, not logically a
method.

A few other good points, too. Shame about the presentation.

Gavin

Brian Schröder

5/26/2005 12:39:00 PM

0

On 26/05/05, gsinclair@gmail.com <gsinclair@gmail.com> wrote:
> ES wrote:
>
> > http://www.ericw.org/rants/showrant.psp...
>
> "It's 5.abs for absolute value, but Math.sqrt(5) for square root."
>
> Good point. That bugs me too. abs is a *function*, not logically a
> method.
>

Why not 5.sqrt instead. Better to ask the object to do something, that
to do something with the object. That allows to use duck typing and
special casing to be done in the "special cased" object. I prefer
"string".length a lot over length(string)

regards,

Brian

> Gavin
>
>


--
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